Broadfoot's latest

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qpsnapper
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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by qpsnapper » Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:54 pm

scottish wrote:
lbb wrote:Thought he was in this 30's. Is that not young anymore
I've no idea of his age other than to say that when I first came across him about seven or eight years ago I did think that any electric razors he might receive for Xmas would be staying in their boxes for a few years.

I'm too old to know what young is anymore. Though I do know that middle-aged is anyone five years older than I am.
Broadfoot was actually a player in the youth set up (U 18's) at Queen's around the mid to late nineties, so he would probably be about 30ish just now.

Although it was good to see the piece, there wasn't anything particularly original in it (and a few errors which seem to be obligatory in pieces about clubs in the lower leagues), but the splurge of publicity we've had in recent days has been very welcome and also brought home what a draw against one of the old firm does for a lower league club's profile.

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Post by Scottish » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:07 pm

Forrest Robertson tells me QP have been allocated 1,500 tickets. Will they really bring that many? Rangers fans with no game that day and no ticket for Forfar the next day, perhaps? Or is that the minimum that can be allocated consistent with SFA and segregation requirements?

Skyline Drifter
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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Skyline Drifter » Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:48 am

lbb wrote:That's the excuse you often hear but I just wonder how much of a sense of occasion you get in a, sometimes, half-empty stadium. I realise not many clubs get to Hampden but it should always be a reward for finalists only, in my book. I accept most clubs, and the SFA, don't see it that way.
Indeed not, and rightly so.

As a Queen of the South fan / member of staff, we were extremely disappointed to hear the odd call from the media for our semi final with Aberdeen last season to be played somewhere away from Hampden for 'the look of the thing'. In our case obviously, playing Aberdeen, geography wasn't really an issue, there being no real advantage in shifting the tie to Edinburgh for instance as some suggested (Allan Preston to name but one).

Most Queens fans hadn't been alive the last time we played a national cup game at Hampden and they wanted the experience. In any event, as David has pointed out, there isn't another ground suitable unless you want to lock people out and frankly I don't think it's right that you consider doing that if it isn't neceessary. Also at the end of the day, there's a financial cost to hiring an alternative ground. Why should a club who didn't earn the right to be at the semi final stage take some of the spoils from it unnecessarily? Play it at Hampden, the SFA keep the ground rent and redistribute to ALL clubs accordingly.

I certainly didn't notice any lack of atmosphere at our game albeit it was half full not quarter full and the manner of the game itself undeniably must have lifted it. A 0-0 or a rout might have been flatter. As it is it was the best occasion of my footballing life to date (I'm not sure even the subsequent final beat it, probably down to the result). I really don't see why a day out at Hampden shouldn't be a consolation reward for semi finalists and only reserved for finalists?

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by lbb » Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:22 am

Skyline Drifter wrote: As a Queen of the South fan / member of staff, we were extremely disappointed to hear the odd call from the media for our semi final with Aberdeen last season to be played somewhere away from Hampden for 'the look of the thing'. In our case obviously, playing Aberdeen, geography wasn't really an issue, there being no real advantage in shifting the tie to Edinburgh for instance as some suggested (Allan Preston to name but one).
This is where it gets difficult. Who wants to be the bad guy who says to Queen of the South fans, who might not get there again for years, that they can't play at Hampden? You're right to point out that distance wasn't an issue - as it suited both clubs - and the match itself was one of the better semi-finals in recent years. This was one of the more difficult ones to call.
Skyline Drifter wrote:In any event, as David has pointed out, there isn't another ground suitable unless you want to lock people out and frankly I don't think it's right that you consider doing that if it isn't neceessary.
'Locking people out' sounds quite emotive. All I'm suggesting is if it's really worthwhile selling an extra 2,000 or 3,000 tickets to play in a half-empty stadium when you could forego those sales and play in a 90%+ full stadium.
Skyline Drifter wrote:Also at the end of the day, there's a financial cost to hiring an alternative ground. Why should a club who didn't earn the right to be at the semi final stage take some of the spoils from it unnecessarily? Play it at Hampden, the SFA keep the ground rent and redistribute to ALL clubs accordingly.
Did the SFA not find themselves in some crippling agreement that involved them having to use Hampden for ALL major games? Or are the financial costs for the new main stand, in particular, so high that the SFA insist on Hampden being used? This is where I wonder whether semi-finals are being played at Hampden for football or romantic and more for hard-headed financial ones.
Skyline Drifter wrote:I really don't see why a day out at Hampden shouldn't be a consolation reward for semi finalists and only reserved for finalists?
The Road To Hampden used to always refer to the path taken towards the Cup Final itself. It was never intended to refer to teams reaching the semi-final. It's a pedantic point, maybe, but there's something to be said for keeping the Final venue 'special' and an achievement in itself playing there.

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Post by LEATHERSTOCKING » Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:54 am

"THE ROAD to HAMPDEN" is certainly one we Queen`s Park supporters thoroughly enjoy. With all good luck it`s a trip to be continued after the 5th Round.

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Scottish » Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:15 am

lbb wrote: 'Locking people out' sounds quite emotive. All I'm suggesting is if it's really worthwhile selling an extra 2,000 or 3,000 tickets to play in a half-empty stadium when you could forego those sales and play in a 90%+ full stadium.
It's emotive enough if you're one of the 2,000 or 3,000 affected.

If the clubs want Hampden give them Hampden. If they want somewhere else (say Aberdeen v ICT or an all-Dundee semi) then give them somewhere else. Where is the problem with that?

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Skyline Drifter » Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:37 am

scottish wrote:
lbb wrote: 'Locking people out' sounds quite emotive. All I'm suggesting is if it's really worthwhile selling an extra 2,000 or 3,000 tickets to play in a half-empty stadium when you could forego those sales and play in a 90%+ full stadium.
It's emotive enough if you're one of the 2,000 or 3,000 affected.

If the clubs want Hampden give them Hampden. If they want somewhere else (say Aberdeen v ICT or an all-Dundee semi) then give them somewhere else. Where is the problem with that?
Yes, I think that's fair. If both clubs are based in the North East and want to opt for a different venue then let them do so, don't force them otherwise. I would have thought an ICT v Dundee side semi final should definitely be played in Aberdeen for instance but I wouldn't dictate it to them and if the clubs prefer to use Hampden then they should be allowed to.

For everyone else Hampden remains the only sensible option, especially since there are now no replays and the semi final is a one off event in a similar manner to the final. Replays are a different animal granted but they are no longer an issue.

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Post by Scottish » Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:54 am

I've been fortunate enough to support a club which has reached its fair share of semi-finals(though admittedly once with drastic twenty-years gap between them) and there have been some shocking decisions on venues in the past from both SFA & SFL. Having Hampden as the default venue but with flexibility seems the most sensible approach.

Aberdeen were always happy to travel to Glasgow to play the OF in front of big crowds but in 1970 they kicked up about facing Killie at Ibrox in the Scottish Cup, saying they were sick fed up with travelling south for semis. The SFA sent the match to Muirton Park - a singularly unfit ground for a major game. The conditions inside were dangerous with fans hanging off floodlight pylons or sitting on top of turnstile roofs trying to get a view. There was fighting at the railway station after the match (there was fighting inside the ground as well but that, I'm afraid, was par for the course at the time. I remember my cousin stood next to me commenting on how the guy being dragged off by six policemen bore a startling resemblance to his brother before the penny dropped_ and that wouldn't have happened had one set been travelling back via Queen Street and the other from Central.

Aberdeen have since played numerous semi-finals in Glasgow v the OF and AFAIK have never complained once.

There was the replay in 1997 at Easter Road when Killie fans felt that one match in Edinburgh was enough. Fir Park or Firhill would have been fine.

There was even one League Cup semi-final (before my time I hasten to add) against Hearts when the SFL picked Easter Road as the venue.

Finally, if you want big crowds for semi-finals don't play them in winter. There are plenty of midweeks available later in the season.

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Broadfoots latest

Post by kiwiscot » Mon Jan 26, 2009 11:01 am

Queen of the South V Aberdeen at Murreyfield would have been an event not to be forgotten, no-one wouldn't have not got a ticket, and a few Edinburgh nuetrals into the bargain and geographically, you couldn't get mutch nuetral, and the winners still had a Cup final to look forward to at Hampden ,. Hibs turned down a big oppertunity a couple of seasons ago, by not wanting to play the Cup Semi Final there because Hearts had played there a few times in the recent past. One wonders what the crowd would have been over the 40,000 odd that was at Hampden that day.Why not play a Rangers/Celtic V Aberdeen/ Dundee United semi there and have real nuetrality. Outside Glasgow probably Pittodrie is one of the best if not the best stadium and as David stated because of geographical area they never staged a semi ,outside the Junior Cup, and when finally 2 teams come along that fill the bill perfectlly, they award it to Edinburgh, unbelievable (not ). I would even go as far as saying maybe Hearts & Hibs for one season should agree to play there 4 ( 3 ) premiership derby matches there and I would lay odds that at least one of the games would break the SPL attedance record.

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Skyline Drifter » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:19 pm

kiwiscot wrote:Queen of the South V Aberdeen at Murreyfield would have been an event not to be forgotten, no-one wouldn't have not got a ticket, and a few Edinburgh nuetrals into the bargain and geographically, you couldn't get mutch nuetral, and the winners still had a Cup final to look forward to at Hampden.
Well yes, but why would you want to take a match like that to a rugby stadium (and remove the rent from football as a sport to an external source) which is even bigger when the initial point was as much about half empty stadiums as anything else? And by the time you are travelling from Aberdeen or Dumfries does it really make much odds whether you play in Edinburgh or Glasgow geographically?

Any neutral that wanted a ticket to that game at Hampden could have had one. The crowd of 24,000 was too big for any neutral football stadium outside Glasgow. It's an absolute no brainer. Can't see why you'd consider playing it anywhere else to be honest. Yes, I can see the argument if the crowd is below 20,000 although even then there isn't an economic argument. But for a 20k plus crowd it simply has to be Hampden.

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Sat31March1928 » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:21 pm

kiwiscot wrote:I would even go as far as saying maybe Hearts & Hibs for one season should agree to play there 4 ( 3 ) premiership derby matches there and I would lay odds that at least one of the games would break the SPL attedance record.
Somebody posted on hibs.net a proposal that the first Edinburgh Derby is played during the Festival at Murrayfield and you market it as a 'Big Sporting Event'. Similarly the Ner'day game is played at New Year (probably have to be the 2nd or 3rd to to policing issues) and again it is marketed as part of the whole 'New Year' experience.
Jackson; James; Jackson; James; Jackson

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by lbb » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:34 pm

kiwiscot wrote: Hibs turned down a big oppertunity a couple of seasons ago, by not wanting to play the Cup Semi Final there because Hearts had played there a few times in the recent past. One wonders what the crowd would have been over the 40,000 odd that was at Hampden that day.
I might offend some Hibs fans here but did Hibs not fail to sell out their allocation for the Scottish Cup semi-final and Hearts did? I remember the game itself it looked like there was a huge Hearts turnout and gaps in the Hibs end. Looked like Hearts were the bigger club, tbh. Why would Hibs fans not come through to Glasgow but Hearts fans would? There might be other factors - Hibs' Scottish Cup record, for one - that I haven't considered.

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by lbb » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:38 pm

scottish wrote: It's emotive enough if you're one of the 2,000 or 3,000 affected.
It won't get much sympathy on here but it's a problem Celtic and Rangers fans have at cup finals. You can't get everyone a ticket. Some people have to miss out and that's just the way it is.
scottish wrote:If the clubs want Hampden give them Hampden. If they want somewhere else (say Aberdeen v ICT or an all-Dundee semi) then give them somewhere else. Where is the problem with that?
It's not something that bothers me that much. I thought, as a player and a manager, you'd prefer a boisterous atmosphere in a semi-final than a ghost-like occasion, which it can sometimes be. But I accept it's not as simple as that for some clubs and ultimately they seem happy with the status quo.

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Re: Broadfoots latest

Post by Skyline Drifter » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:08 pm

lbb wrote:
scottish wrote: It's emotive enough if you're one of the 2,000 or 3,000 affected.
It won't get much sympathy on here but it's a problem Celtic and Rangers fans have at cup finals. You can't get everyone a ticket. Some people have to miss out and that's just the way it is.
Well yes, but that's by necessity. If we're using the biggest neutral football stadium in the country there's not much that can be done about that is there? Just as not everyone can get a ticket to big Scotland internationals. That IS just the way it is. Sympathy doesn't come in to it, there's nothing that can be done about it short of building a bigger again stadium.

That's entirely different to suggesting we should purposely lock people out of semi finals for the sake of having a full half sized stadium rather than a less than full much bigger stadium. That's an absolutely crazy notion in my opinion. At a time when the game is complaining that custom is down you are advocating preventing customers attending the big events.

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Broadfoots latest

Post by kiwiscot » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:27 pm

If I remember correctly,there was some kind of unwritten understanding through the late 50s & early 60s when floodlights were in there infancy that Rangers played semis at Hampden and Celtic played at Ibrox, things went along fine for a few years until 1969 cup semis and the SFA deemed that Celtic would play Morton at Hampden and Rangers would have to go to Parkhead to play Aberdeen, Rangers meanwhile protested about this desiscion but the SFA held firm on there original venues, but the arguments in the paper went on for a few weeks, So the SFA took the step anouncing that all future semis would be at Hampden only to recind that the next season when Aberdeen protested that it wasnt fair. But from 70/71 season onwards we had the spectacle of both League Cup semi finals ( Monday & Wednesday ) and Scottish Cup Semi Finals ( Wednesday & Saturday ) all being played at Hampden until 1974 when the SFL scared by the previous years attendance at the Killie /Dundee semi, allowed Hibs to play Airdrie at Tynecastle. I guess since then variou s office bearers, have had their own input into Semis and of course the vastly shrunk capacities of Stadia from the 60s. has been a factor too.

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