Scottish Cup 2015-16

The place to discuss Scottish football
Alan McCabe
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 1:01 am
Location: Falkirk
Contact:

Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by Alan McCabe » Wed Jun 10, 2015 7:56 am

An interesting development in the Scottish Cup structure now sees the winner of the Scottish Amateur Cup granted access to the Prelimenary Round of the senior competition.
Kirkintilloch's Harestanes Amateurs will be the first club to appear under the new policy. Yet more interesting and exciting developments in the way the Scottish Cup has opened up in recent years. My understanding is that Harestanes' basic ground could meet Prelimenary Round criteria but any advancement and further home ties would probably see Broadwood utilised.
It will mean Kirkintilloch will be represented in the national cup for the first time in around 125 years.
With a number of other clubs close to securing SFA Licensing, the Scottish Cup is rapidly expanding to a level of participation not witnessed since the inter-war years. Here is a dilemma though...on the basis that the winners of both the Scottish Junior and Scottish Amateur Cups qualify for the main competition, could it reasonably be claimed there are now around 900 entries annually?
I'll just concentrate on researching the main competition for now though!

LEATHERSTOCKING
Posts: 1623
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by LEATHERSTOCKING » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:15 pm

In 2010, the SAFA banned Queen`s Park from entering their U20(Hampden Xl) side from the Amateur Cup because their 1st Xl didn`t play in an amateur league, How petty can you get?

HibeeJibee
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by HibeeJibee » Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:22 pm

If you restrict yourself to Saturday playing, regular season format, XI-aside clubs, then the admission of the Amateur Cup winner means that virtually every such club has a theoretical route into the Scottish Cup. (And if you want to take it to extremes: onward into the Europa League then the Champions League then the Club World Cup!!).

Only the handful of members of the North Caledonian League - which holds a strange quasi-senior status - and whatever remnants are left of Welfare football of this type cannot make it in through a senior league, a junior league/cup, or the Amateur Cup.

I understand SAFA's lobbied for it for some time, and given the SJFA's representation it seems a justified development.

BMCCOLL
Posts: 1046
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:48 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by BMCCOLL » Thu Jun 11, 2015 8:37 pm

The last club from Kirkintilloch to play in the Cup were Kirkintilloch Athletic, knocked out by Slamannan Rovers in the first preliminary round on 2 Sep 1893, 112 years ago!
http://scottish-football-historical-archive.co.nf

Alan McCabe
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 1:01 am
Location: Falkirk
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by Alan McCabe » Thu Jun 11, 2015 9:56 pm

Come on Brian. 1893 to 2015 is 122 years!
Must be number blindness with all those statistics!
:lol:

BMCCOLL
Posts: 1046
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:48 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by BMCCOLL » Fri Jun 12, 2015 5:15 pm

To tell you the truth, this 21st century malarky has fried ma brain! :lol:
http://scottish-football-historical-archive.co.nf

HibeeJibee
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by HibeeJibee » Sat Jun 13, 2015 9:56 pm

Alan McCabe wrote:My understanding is that Harestanes' basic ground could meet Prelimenary Round criteria but any advancement and further home ties would probably see Broadwood utilised.
Just a point on this... should it occur then Clyde, Cumbernauld Colts and Harestanes AFC will all use the same stadium for their home ties.

That can't have happened very often.

gogsy1968
Posts: 234
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 3:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by gogsy1968 » Sat Jun 13, 2015 10:32 pm

When does the draw for the preliminary round take place?

HibeeJibee
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by HibeeJibee » Sun Jun 14, 2015 1:52 pm

In the season just ended the first ties were August 16th - drawn July 17th... in 2012-13 they were August 4th - drawn July 3rd.

There will be 2 preliminary rounds, as there are too many unlicensed clubs for only 1 preliminary round to bring them down to the number of spaces left in R1. (Licensed clubs are exempt from preliminary ties under Scottish Cup rules). By my maths there are 92 entrants now?

According to a poster called 'Northerner' on the FitbaNorth site:
There will be two Preliminary Rounds; the First will be played on Sat 15 August and will involve 15 clubs - 5 ties and 5 byes. The winners and byes then go through to the Second Preliminary Round on 5 September.

Incidentally, according to HL fixturelist the subsequent rounds are:

R1 - September 26th
R2 - October 24th
R3 - November 28th
R4 - January 9th

Welcome return of R4 to January, IMO.

Swampy
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 3:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by Swampy » Sun Jun 14, 2015 5:00 pm

Surely Duncansfield in Kilsyth is sufficient for the First Round, rather than having (potentially) three clubs using Broadwood (which would be far, far too big and ornate for a Harestanes game)? If Yarrow Park's good enough for the First Round so's what's left of Duncansfield.

HibeeJibee
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by HibeeJibee » Sun Jun 14, 2015 8:20 pm

According to rulebook: if a tie can't be played at a home ground it has to be moved to the nearest registered ground (i.e. of an SFA member) with an equivalent capacity which is "deemed suitable"; that seems to rule-out Junior grounds.

Actual criteria are fairly low: enclosed ground, roped pitch, pavilion beside/near the pitch and parking.

Everything else required of qualifiers grounds - e.g. ability to provide refreshments, toilets and catering - could be provided by gazebos, portaloos, burger vans, etc.


There have been 3 or 4 Junior qualifiers every season since 2007 all of whom, AFAIA, have been able to use their home grounds... So were EOS League champions Stirling University in 2012, and Lothian Thistle Hutchison Vale in the season just ended (and again next season presumably). However in 2008 Crichton the SOS League champions were apparently told that Hospital Park was unsuitable and they would have used Palmerston if they'd got a draw off Clachnacuddin.

Swampy
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 3:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by Swampy » Sun Jun 14, 2015 11:30 pm

Fair enough. Restricting it to registered grounds makes sense for licensing reasons I suppose, but at the same time there's got to be a sanity check there (hypothetically, Hearts couldn't play at Murrayfield if something happened to Tynecastle.) And like you say, Junior clubs must get their grounds checked when they qualify anyway so there's got to be some answer here.

I guess opening one stand at Broadwood wouldn't be too ruinous but a Junior ground seems far more appropriate for the occasion, and cheaper too.

gogsy1968
Posts: 234
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 3:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by gogsy1968 » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:27 pm

Kelty Hearts have confirmed on their twitter account that the revamp of their ground will not be completed until September. Does this mean they will have to play at Cowdenbeath if drawn at home in either of the preliminary rounds?

HibeeJibee
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by HibeeJibee » Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:52 pm

Presumably that would depend on Central Park's availability: they might not want it played on 2 days running, or stock cars might be using it. If not then it would need to be one of the other Fife SPFL grounds or Burntisland, if the rule as applied as per the rulebook.

According to the SFA website both Coldstream (EOS League) and Glasgow University (an oddity - they play in the Caledonian Amateur League) have got licensed so they'll be entering directly at R1 along with howevermany Highland/Lowland clubs plus Linlithgow Rose and Banks o'Dee.

If the FitbaNorth poster is correct the breakdowns must be:

PR1 - 15 clubs join (5 ties & 5 byes)
PR2 - (5 ties)
R1 - 31 clubs join (18 ties)
R2 - 14 clubs join (16 ties)
R3 - 16 clubs join (16 ties)
R4 - 16 clubs join (16 ties)

gogsy1968
Posts: 234
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 3:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Cup 2015-16

Post by gogsy1968 » Wed Jun 17, 2015 7:27 pm

HibeeJibee wrote:Presumably that would depend on Central Park's availability: they might not want it played on 2 days running, or stock cars might be using it. If not then it would need to be one of the other Fife SPFL grounds or Burntisland, if the rule as applied as per the rulebook.

According to the SFA website both Coldstream (EOS League) and Glasgow University (an oddity - they play in the Caledonian Amateur League) have got licensed so they'll be entering directly at R1 along with howevermany Highland/Lowland clubs plus Linlithgow Rose and Banks o'Dee.

If the FitbaNorth poster is correct the breakdowns must be:

PR1 - 15 clubs join (5 ties & 5 byes)
PR2 - (5 ties)
R1 - 31 clubs join (18 ties)
R2 - 14 clubs join (16 ties)
R3 - 16 clubs join (16 ties)
R4 - 16 clubs join (16 ties)

Thanks totally forgot about Burntisland.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 4 guests