Derek Whyte

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Derek Whyte

Post by Scottish » Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:13 am

Q Roger Campbell, assistant coach Aston Villa U-13 writes: “You answered one of my queries from last year regarding the football career of Tom Boyd. He was presenting the trophies at the U-12 football team which I am assistant coach. So this year I have managed to procure the services of Derek Whyte, ex Celtic, Aberdeen, Middlesbrough and Scotland servant and of course recently deposed co-manager of Partick Thistle. So I would be grateful if you could furnish me with career information on him.”

A Derek Whyte was born in Glasgow on August 31st 1968 and joined Celtic, aged 17. He made his debut, still only 17, in a 1-1 draw at home to Hearts on Feb 22nd 1986. The young defender must have made a big impression as he retained his place for the remainder of that season. Of the 11 league games he took part in, Celtic drew the first three and won the next eight to pip Hearts to the title on goal difference.

For the next six years he was a mainstay of the Celtic defence either at left-back or as a central defender. He played in the double-winning side of Celtic’s centenary season in 1988 and in the team that retained the Scottish Cup the following year.

It wasn’t winners medals all the way though. Derek also played in the team which finished runners-up in the League and League Cup in 1986-87 and in the side which was the first to lose a Scottish Cup final on penalties in 1990.

By 1992 Celtic were struggling in the wake of a revitalised Rangers and after 275 appearances and eight goals (League 216A 7G, Cup 26A, League Cup 18 A, Europe 15A 1G) Whyte made his last Celtic appearance as a substitute at Aberdeen in a league game in August 1992.

Still not quite 24 he was transferred to Middlesbrough for a club record fee of £900,000 to strengthen a Boro side which had won promotion to the inaugural FA Premier League.

Unfortunately Boro were relegated but came back two years later with Derek winning a First Division champions medal. His five years on Teesside were tumultuous ones as the club not only moved up and down but also left Ayresome Park for the Riverside Stadium and a stint which began alongside fellow Scots like Willie Falconer, John Hendrie and Bernie Slaven ended in the company of Juninho, Emerson and Ravanelli.

Derek had the distinction of setting up Hendrie for the last goal ever scored at Ayresome Park on April 30th 1995. His last full season was a disappointing one as Boro reached and lost both major Cup Finals in 1996-97 (though Derek played in neither) and the side were relegated once again. Back in the First Division he played his final game for Boro in a 4-0 home win over Reading in December 1997. He had notched up 195 first team appearances and scored three times (League 167A 2G, Cup 6A, League Cup 16A 1G, Anglo-Italian Cup 6A).

A week later and after £100,000 had changed hands between the clubs he was making his debut for Aberdeen at Rugby Park as the Dons went down 1-0 to Kilmarnock in the League five days before Xmas 1997.

Like his previous two clubs Derek Whyte gave Aberdeen sterling service over the next few years, making 155 first class appearances (League 134A, Cup 12A, League Cup 8A, Europe 1A), including another Scottish Cup Final appearance in the ill-fated match of 200 against Rangers when early injury to Jim Leighton effectively ended the game as a contest. His last game as a Don was on May 12th 2002 in a 1-0 home defeat by Celtic in the league.

Freed by Aberdeen he was back in the SPL at the start of the next season with newly-promoted Partick Thistle, making his debut on August 3rd 2002 in a 0-0 league draw with Dundee United at Firhill. He played 45 times for the Jags (League 40A, League Cup 5A) before hanging up his boots, aged 35, after a 3-0 Firhill league defeat against Aberdeen on December 13th 2003.

That brought down the curtain on a playing career which had lasted almost 18 years and 670 first class matches. It wasn’t the end of Derek Whyte and football though for he was appointed co-manager of Thistle along with Gerry Britton

Unfortunately the pair couldn’t keep the Jags in the SPL and with a second successive relegation looming he and Britton parted company with the Maryhill club a year later.

Derek also served Scotland with distinction, making his international debut aged just 19 as a substitute for Maurice Malpas in a 2-0 win over Belgium in a European Championship qualifier at Hampden in October 1987. In his 12 international appearances, Scotland won six, drew five and lost only one.

His personal record is even more impressive. That solitary defeat – against the USA in 1996 – was the first time any side scored against Scotland when Derek Whyte was on the field. And that was in his NINTH international. All told Scotland lost only three goals in two matches of the twelve he played in (Ecuador also scored in a 2-1 Scottish win in the Kirin Cup in Japan in 1995 but Whyte had been substituted by the time the goal was scored). Nine of his twelve games were Scottish shut-outs.

Which make sit all the more surprising that he never took part in a major finals though he was a squad member for the European Championships of 1992 and 1996 and also for the World Cup in 1998.

Derek’s final Scotland appearance was as a substitute in the memorable 1-0 win over Germany in Bremen in April 1999.

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Post by Lisbon67 » Tue Jun 28, 2005 1:59 pm

Not one of the greatest but massively under-rated in my view. I never realised his Scotland record was so impressive.

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Post by Sat31March1928 » Tue Jun 28, 2005 9:15 pm

His Scotland Record

His Career span made him 33rd in the All time list.

Scotland Careers by length

Interesting is the players round about him. Just below John Grieg but above Billy McNeil.


26 Gordon Strachan Aberdeen Manchester United Leeds United 11y 10m 10d 50

27 Davie Meiklejohn Rangers 11y 9m 26d 15

28 John Collins Hibernian Celtic AS Monaco Everton 11y 9m 1d 58

29 Bobby Evans Celtic Chelsea 11y 7m 17d 48

30 Graeme Souness Middlesborough Liverpool UC Sampdoria 11y 7m 10d 54

31 Jim Cruickshank Heart of Midlothian 11y 7m 6d 6

32 John Greig Rangers 11y 6m 19d 44

33 Derek Whyte Celtic Middlesborough Aberdeen 11y 6m 15d 12

34 Alexander Archibald Rangers 11y 1m 29d 8

35 Billy McNeill Celtic 11y 1m 13d 29
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Post by Scottish » Tue Jun 28, 2005 11:24 pm

Amazing stuff! Just looked at the link. I'd have put Leighton, Law and Dalglish as the players with the longest span but was really surprised to find Ned Doig top of the pile. Just as surprising to see that Stevie Crawford is the contemporary player with the longest international career span.

How do you work out the 'weighted' caps?

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Post by Sat31March1928 » Wed Jun 29, 2005 5:25 am

scottish wrote:Amazing stuff! Just looked at the link. I'd have put Leighton, Law and Dalglish as the players with the longest span but was really surprised to find Ned Doig top of the pile. Just as surprising to see that Stevie Crawford is the contemporary player with the longest international career span.

How do you work out the 'weighted' caps?
Based on the number of games played by Scotland in a particular year.
The most ever was 12. I've used that no as the base for calculation.

Each Cap is then 'weighted' according to the number of games played by Scotland in a year.

So if there was only
1 game in a year that would be worth 12
2 games in a year would be worth 6
3 games in a year would be worth 4
4 games in a year would be worth 3
5 games in a year would be worth 12/5 = 2.4

etc

Thus players in the early years get a higher 'weighting' than players from the modern era because they had fewer games available to play in.

e.g.

Looking at 3 Hearts players


Bobby Walker won his 29 caps when Scotland only played 3 games per season. Thus each Cap is weighted as 4.

'Barney' Battles won his only cap in 1930-31 as there were 6 games played that is worth 2 'weighted' Caps

http://www.londonhearts.com/scotland/sea/1930-31.html

Whereas Donald Ford's 3 caps were won in 1973-74 and are only worth 1
'weighted' Cap each.

http://www.londonhearts.com/scotland/sea/1973-74.html

If you have any suggestions for making the alogorithm more spohisticated I can apply those rule as well.
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Post by bobby s » Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:53 pm

That's quite clever that.

I like that as a weighting.
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Post by Gersman » Thu Jun 30, 2005 2:49 pm

The weighting's a neat idea which puts careers like Alan Morton's in a better perspective. All but one of his caps were in the Home Internationals which were virtually the only games played at the time.

But the downside is that somebody who only played once, say, in a season where there just three games automatically gets bumped up to four weighted caps even though he may actually have played a real stinker and neveer come under consideration again.

Still a good idea though and I can't think of any way to avoid the downside
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Post by Sat31March1928 » Fri Jul 01, 2005 11:36 am

Gersman wrote:The weighting's a neat idea which puts careers like Alan Morton's in a better perspective. All but one of his caps were in the Home Internationals which were virtually the only games played at the time.

But the downside is that somebody who only played once, say, in a season where there just three games automatically gets bumped up to four weighted caps even though he may actually have played a real stinker and neveer come under consideration again.

Still a good idea though and I can't think of any way to avoid the downside
I've thought of weighting the Caps to the type of game as well or taking into account 'length of service'.

To say the selection process was haphazard in the early days would be an undersatement.

In the 1880s 32 and 33 players were used in a single season where only 3 games were played. See 'Pl' column

Season List

1887-88

What I can do is set a threshold of minimum caps or length of service and rerun to produce a smaller list.

However if you look at the the Top names who didn't get 50 'real caps', all of them would deserve to be in the 'Hall of Fame'

Bobby Walker Heart of Midlothian
Alan Morton Queens Park Rangers
Bobby Evans Celtic Chelsea
Charlie Thomson Heart of Midlothian Sunderland
John Greig Rangers
Alec Smith Rangers
Lawrie Reilly Hibernian
Charles Campbell Queens Park
Harry McNiel Queens Park
Hughie Gallacher Airdrieonians Newcastle United Chelsea Derby County
Eric Caldow Rangers
Andy Anderson Heart of Midlothian
Jim Baxter Rangers Sunderland
Billy MacKinnon Queens Park
Billy Steel Greenock Morton Derby County Dundee
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Post by Scottish » Fri Jul 01, 2005 7:52 pm

Can't argue with any of those.

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