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Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:23 pm
by sjh91
Hi, first post, any help would be greatly appreciated.

Started a project recently trying to put the team line-ups from all Clyde games onto a spreadsheet, season by season. Obviously there are plenty of sources for recent years, but I can't seem to find any other source for the mid 90's and before, except the Clyde View programme.

Got two problems with the 94-95 season, first is a Scottish Cup tie against Dundee United on 28th January. The Clyde View only listed two subs, McKenzie and Hillcoat. Who was the third sub, and did he replace anyone?

Secondly, League game with Brechin City on 22 April, The CV lists Graham Watson twice in the starting line-up, can anyone tell me the actual starting XI?

Lastly, the last two games of the 96-97 season, vs Hamilton on 3rd May and vs QOS on 10th May, it lists all substitutes in both games as being unused, can anyone confirm this?

My programmes only go back to the 92-93 season, can anyone recommend any sources, either online or books, that I could use to find team line-ups before this season? I was thinking of using the Scottish Football League reviews in the Mitchell Library, but they only seem to date back to 81-82.

Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks!

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 3:17 pm
by LEATHERSTOCKING
Scottish Football Review is undoubtedly your best source but for earlier years there`s always Rothmans although there ARE errors in them and also the Rutherglen Reformer newspaper and various national papers. It`s a long slog but that`s what the hobby involves I`m afraid. Have you contacted John Taylor who edits the Clyde programme?

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 4:18 pm
by gogsy1968
According to Dundee Uniteds next programme after the game in 1994/5 Prunty replaced McKenzie in the 49th minute and Neill replaced Nisbet in the 80th minute. Hillcoat was the unused sub.

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:32 pm
by Scottish
Apr 22nd 1995: Hillcoat, O'Neill, McCheyne, Watson, Knox, Brown, Nisbet, McConnell, McCluskey, McCarron, Falconer. According to Rothmans.

Rothmans again: 96-97 v Hamilton. Campbell came on for Michael O'Neill. V QoS Brownlie came on for McCheyene & McPhee for Michael O'Neill.

SFL Reviews are the most accurate source but as you've realised they don't go further back than the early 80s. If you look at the thread on this site for online sources you'll find links to The Herald (full) & the Evening Times to January 1951. Sports editions of the latter are excellent for line-ups. Worst source is match programmes as these are printed in advance and players can be injured, fall out of favour, even be transferred before the match takes place.

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 8:58 am
by Shawfield Boy
Hello sjh91, it's always good to hear from a fellow Bully Wee fan.

I had the same idea as you do, in terms of compiling a spreadsheet, about 8 years ago. I'm now about 90% there, with the ultimate aim of getting a book out via the club, but work and family commitments keep getting in the way! I'll send you a pm about the online sources I use. I do go to the Mitchell quite regularly, but have only really used it for newspapers (the Evening Times, Herald, Record, Sunday Mail, Post, Rutherglen Reformer etc). My approach to date has essentially been a data collection exercise. When an anomoly arises, if I can't resolve it there and then I will note it for later research. One surprising thing I found was that the Rutherglen Reformer, certainly in the past, tended to concentrate on Rutherglen Glencairn, and it also goes through phases as to giving the Clyde team list or not, so it wasn't the ideal source I thought it would be.

I also head up The Clyde Archive, which hasn't really got off the ground yet (apart from the Hall of Fame presented at the Sportsman's Dinner), but which is there for all interested in the history of the club. If you're interested let me know (and if you're good at setting up web sites......).

Happy Hunting!

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 5:41 pm
by sjh91
Thanks for the responses guys!
Scottish Football Review is undoubtedly your best source but for earlier years there`s always Rothmans although there ARE errors in them and also the Rutherglen Reformer newspaper and various national papers. It`s a long slog but that`s what the hobby involves I`m afraid. Have you contacted John Taylor who edits the Clyde programme?
That's a good suggestion.
According to Dundee Uniteds next programme after the game in 1994/5 Prunty replaced McKenzie in the 49th minute and Neill replaced Nisbet in the 80th minute. Hillcoat was the unused sub.
I believe this was for the replay, I was looking for the original tie that finished 0-0, which I have since found. I had Prunty down as being unused in the replay though, so thanks for that!
Apr 22nd 1995: Hillcoat, O'Neill, McCheyne, Watson, Knox, Brown, Nisbet, McConnell, McCluskey, McCarron, Falconer. According to Rothmans.

Rothmans again: 96-97 v Hamilton. Campbell came on for Michael O'Neill. V QoS Brownlie came on for McCheyene & McPhee for Michael O'Neill.

SFL Reviews are the most accurate source but as you've realised they don't go further back than the early 80s. If you look at the thread on this site for online sources you'll find links to The Herald (full) & the Evening Times to January 1951. Sports editions of the latter are excellent for line-ups. Worst source is match programmes as these are printed in advance and players can be injured, fall out of favour, even be transferred before the match takes place.
Cheers. When I said I go by the programme, I meant the following edition which usually lists the previous weeks team. It is mostly reliable, but still the odd error here and there. I'll be sure to check out those online sources!
Hello sjh91, it's always good to hear from a fellow Bully Wee fan.

I had the same idea as you do, in terms of compiling a spreadsheet, about 8 years ago. I'm now about 90% there, with the ultimate aim of getting a book out via the club, but work and family commitments keep getting in the way! I'll send you a pm about the online sources I use. I do go to the Mitchell quite regularly, but have only really used it for newspapers (the Evening Times, Herald, Record, Sunday Mail, Post, Rutherglen Reformer etc). My approach to date has essentially been a data collection exercise. When an anomoly arises, if I can't resolve it there and then I will note it for later research. One surprising thing I found was that the Rutherglen Reformer, certainly in the past, tended to concentrate on Rutherglen Glencairn, and it also goes through phases as to giving the Clyde team list or not, so it wasn't the ideal source I thought it would be.

I also head up The Clyde Archive, which hasn't really got off the ground yet (apart from the Hall of Fame presented at the Sportsman's Dinner), but which is there for all interested in the history of the club. If you're interested let me know (and if you're good at setting up web sites......).

Happy Hunting!
Great stuff, will send you a PM!

Re: Few Clyde team line-up queries (94-95 and 96-97)

Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:15 am
by bobby s
Shawfield Boy wrote:and if you're good at setting up web sites......).
Check out www.fitbastats.com - we'd be interested in putting the info up online. Currently, Hibs, Rangers, Celtic, Forfar Athletic, Scotland, Scotland B and Elgin are online and we're working on Third Lanark and Partick Thistle.