Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

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HibeeJibee
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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by HibeeJibee » Fri Aug 31, 2012 10:59 am

If Rangers play Forres like they played Berwick on Saturday, I'd favour Forres...


IIRC - it was techincally-speaking 'a sweetener to the Seniors to give a sweetener to the Juniors'? David Taylor & Co first proposed 4x Juniors plus 8x Qualifying Cup quarter-finalists (it being semi-finalists at the time) qualifying, eliminating the 12 old R1 byes.

However, with some justification, full members cried foul over only a portion of them qualifying while 4 non-members did.

Their fellow Senior non-members not having access also appeared inequitable.

Plan B was therefore the adopted model, with rejigged rounds (Top 16/Next 16/Next 14), everyone entering. Plus winners of Senior non-leagues - but not cups - who are non-members can also qualify, as Crichton and now Stirling Uni have.

Going forward, with plans to restrict the cup to Licensed clubs from around 2015 / 2016, current R1 may soon hardly exist.


EDIT: Of course the spirit of the Qualifying Cup lived-on in their replacement Challenge Cups, although these were opened to SFA non-members in HFL/EOS/SOS too. Their silverware are the Qualifying Cup replica trophies

North Challenge Cup only lasted 2 seasons, though, being abolished when HFL expanded from 15 clubs to 18 in 2009.

South Challenge Cup is still going strong and is very well regarded in the EOS/SOS game particularly by clubs who don't enter the Scottish Cup. However after the SFA's initial 2 year funding support finished, it's now split into "South-West" and "North-East" sections before the Quarter-Finals, and Girvan no longer participate.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Snuff » Fri Aug 31, 2012 2:09 pm

Come on Forrest - bad though Rangers might be away from home this season, I don't see Forres scoring ten - I wager Ra Peepul will break-in and halt the game if it gets to five!!!
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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by LEATHERSTOCKING » Fri Aug 31, 2012 2:17 pm

Surely not! Those cuddly Bers will stand back & applaud the Highlan chentlemen & even join in the chanting,"We want six, we want...". Anyway, the tie of the round is QUEEN`S PARK vs. IRVINE MEADOW - Best team outside the SPL(beaten an SPL side already the League Cup, a 1st Division one in the Challenge Cup & lost 4-5 to another by 2 goals in the last 90 seconds) vs. the Super League Champions. Hurry, hurry for your tickets now while stocks last.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by sam peckinpah » Fri Aug 31, 2012 7:57 pm

I attended the Glasgow University vs. Selkirk tie and there were around 70 people present. The programme noted Uni's 15-0 loss to St Mirren and, of course, Selkirk's 20-0 hammering at Stirling. Two of the worst results in modern times.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by LLD » Sat Sep 01, 2012 9:06 pm

Edinburgh City's programme today gives the attendance for their game v Shotts Bon Accord at Hannah Park last week as 304.
No attendance announced at Meadowbank this afternoon - my guesstimate is around 250.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:03 pm

jimmygrumble wrote:Some further details from Highland League site
Is this from the official Highland League site? Or Highlandleague.net? The latter used to give crowd figures for matches involving HL clubs in the line-ups tab of the report.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:06 pm

HibeeJibee wrote:If Rangers play Forres like they played Berwick on Saturday, I'd favour Forres...
So would I. In fact you could go so far as to say they simply didn't turn up for the game. Which of course is right, seeing as it was on the Sunday, not the Saturday!


HibeeJibee wrote:EDIT: Of course the spirit of the Qualifying Cup lived-on in their replacement Challenge Cups, although these were opened to SFA non-members in HFL/EOS/SOS too. Their silverware are the Qualifying Cup replica trophies

North Challenge Cup only lasted 2 seasons, though, being abolished when HFL expanded from 15 clubs to 18 in 2009.

South Challenge Cup is still going strong and is very well regarded in the EOS/SOS game particularly by clubs who don't enter the Scottish Cup. However after the SFA's initial 2 year funding support finished, it's now split into "South-West" and "North-East" sections before the Quarter-Finals, and Girvan no longer participate.
Yes, this is similar to what happened in the mid-1950s when there was an all-in Scottish Cup draw.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:10 pm

LEATHERSTOCKING wrote:Sporting Life`s 1st Round details are missing a few bits eg. Hawick`s 1st scorer, Hermes goal scorer
Hawick: Power 51 mins, Hermes: Wilson (don't know time of goal but first half, after 26th minute when they went three down.

Sorry, just seen Jimmy Grumble has given these details. Wilson 38 mins for Hermes, Power 52. Inevitably times of goalscorers will be recorded differently.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:22 pm

Many thanks to all who have responded so far. No information as of yet for attendances at yesterday's replays though goalscoreres are all recorded. I've seen Hermes given as 300 as well the 250 added here and Threave Rovers was 200. I make this the attendance list to date (home team only)

Bonnyrigg Rose 400
Buckie Thistle 250
Formartine United 350
Glasgow University 70
Hawick Royal Albert 114
Hermes 250/300
Irvine Meadow 431
Shotts Bon Accord 304
Threave Rovers 200
Whitehill Welfare 184

No information for the following:
Civil Service Strollers
Clachnacuddin
Edinburgh University
Fraserburgh
Huntly
Preston Athletic
Spartans
Turriff United

I'm surprised to see the Highland clubs in that list of no infos.

Also as yet nothing for the replays:
Edinburgh City
Rothes
Wigtown & Bladnoch

And nothing yet for the preliminary round:
Fort William
Keith

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by prorege » Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:16 am

I was at the Edinburgh City v Shotts replay. It's hard to do a decent estimate at Meadowbank but the crowd was smaller than I had expected. My 'best guess' would be 250.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by bobby s » Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:32 pm

Just to update the Bonnyrigg figure, 385 was the official attendance that's been given to me.
It's the Hope I can't stand

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:12 am

This is a bit cheeky, I know, but is there anyone who has subscribed to the highlandleague.net results service? That gives crowd figures for Highland clubs in the Scottish Cup. I used to subscribe but as it costs around the same as the ENFA website which offers thousands more by way of information generally and lists every single crowd figure for every English game since 1888 I felt it wasn't worth renewing my subscription for the sake of between half a dozen and a dozen crowd figures.

But I'm quite prepared to freeload on anyone who has.

Some amendments to 2011-12 figures not previously given.
Round One
Dalbeattie Star v Inverurie Locos 186
Round Two
Culter v Spartans 342

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Thu Oct 04, 2012 5:45 pm

More info for this seasons. Preliminary round - Keith, estimated 90 - according to info from St Cuthbert Wanderers. Second round, Dalbeattie Star 231, not 220, official from the club.

The lack of information on this season's early games - much worse than in previous years - prompted me to email every non-league club that has taken part since 2007 and for which a full record of attendances doesn't exist. I've already had some good feedback as you can see from the above. However there are four clubs which appear to be impossible to contact. Emails are bounced back from both Edinburgh & Glasgow University FC's websites and neither Gala Fairydean nor Wigtown & Bladnoch appear to have any web presence at all. If anyone has any other contact details short of writing a letter - so very 20th century -I would appreciate it.

I also took the opportunity, though I knew it was a long shot, to ask if any club had records of the 1954-57 period which, as you know, was similar in format to the one we have now but records of which were even worse than now. Buckie Thistle programme editor and historian Easton Thain has very kindly come up with some details as follows (I've bolded up the ones which people might already have, so you can see the new information clearly):
5,020 v Peebles Rovers 20/2/1954
1,050 v Eyemouth 11/9/54
1,150 v Duns 25/9/54
2,000 v Peterhead 9/10/54
5,600 v Queen's Park 23/10/1954
2,400 v Inverness Thistle 5/2/1955
5,400 v Hearts 19/2/1955

V Rothes 10/9/55 – no record
2,400 v Inverness Thistle 24/9/55
1,500 v Lossiemouth 8/9/56
2,200 v Newton Stewart 6/10/56

In addition, the match v Ayr United on 7/2/1953, generally given as 4,000 is 4,400 according to Easton's records.

One final thing. The match with Duns on 25/9/1954 which is given as 1-1 in John Byrne's 'Scottish Cup 1873-1986' was actually won 8-1 by Buckie Thistle. Which should finally end that frustrating search for a replay date some of us have been doing for far too long. A look at the results for the Evening Times and the Herald produces a smudge which could be a zero, a three or an eight but if the club historian says it's eight then that's good enough for me.

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by Scottish » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:07 pm

Culter v Burntisland Shipyard 2011-12 R1 approx 350
Hermes v Deveronvale 2012-13 R1 205

Does anyone know the venue for Stirling University v Bonnyrigg Rose last Saturday?

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Re: Scottish Cup 1st round info - worse than ever

Post by bobby s » Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:05 pm

I was there! It was held on Stirling university campus.
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