Dave Halliday

Scottish Football Answers to Questions

Postby kirk » Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:43 pm

Hiya Scottish,

They stats on Dave Halliday are very very impressive. Quite clearly the man was mr goals, we could with his like at Queens now. Something I find amazing about Queens is that for a club formed in 1919 probably the 2 best strikers to have passed through the club and possibly the best 3(and of course it is very much open to debate, it's all long long before probably all of our times) all did so in the first 2 years - Halliday, Ian Dickson and Hughie Gallacher. The mind boggles at how 3 players of that standard would get on playing together at Queens now.

If you do get access to any info on of the other players that you mention then fantastic; no issue if not, I don't want to be a nuisance.

Best wishes all,
Kirk
kirk
 
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Postby kirk » Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:46 pm

Hi again Skyline,

It was indeed Eric who I spoke with. He was very pleasant and very helpful but he wasn't aware of the book that you refer to. If you happen to hear of a copy up for sale anywhere please let me know.

Cheers again,
Kirk
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Postby Skyline Drifter » Mon Jun 30, 2008 8:04 am

kirk wrote:Hi again Skyline,

It was indeed Eric who I spoke with. He was very pleasant and very helpful but he wasn't aware of the book that you refer to. If you happen to hear of a copy up for sale anywhere please let me know.

Cheers again,
Kirk

He's merely forgotten about it then. He was working in the club shop (before he became secretary) as I was when we sold it on behalf of Iain McCartney.

There certainly aren't any copies left at the club. Don't know if Iain himself might have some. He attends most games so far as I know. I'm sure you could track him down. It was for sale in local bookshops at the time too but as it was now 3 or 4 years ago I'd be surprised if you found one now. e-bay perhaps?
Skyline Drifter
 
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Location: Dumfries

Postby kirk » Tue Jul 01, 2008 3:40 pm

Looks like I've got lucky, someone offered to sell me a 2nd hand copy

Cheers again,
Kirk
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Postby kirk » Sun Jul 20, 2008 1:03 am

Hi again,

I've got the Iain Mccartney book on Queens and I'm thoroughly enjoying it and it is proving a treasure of info for many players, but not all. I have updated the wikipedia page on Dave Halliday, created a page on his younger brother Billy and shared numerous other magnificent pieces of into with the world.

Does anyone know anything about Bob McDougall who played for Queens in their fledgling days? I read that he was an F.A. Cup finalist with Liverpool in 1913/14. Does anyone know anything else about him.

Regards,
Kirk
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Re:

Postby Dumpling » Thu Apr 20, 2017 4:45 am

Scottish wrote:Hi there and welcome to the forum.

I don’t want to duplicate the wikipedia article which can be seen here.

Halliday started out as a left-winger with Arrol-Johnston – one of the teams which formed Queen of the South in 1919. At QoS he scored 13 times in 19 games in 1919-20. At St Mirren he played 13 league games in 1920-21, scoring twice before moving to Dens. It was at Dundee - where the celebrated Alec Troup played on the left wing - that he was converted to centre-forward. His record in 1923-24 when he scored 38 league goals in 36 matches is a very good one, coming as it did in the era of the three-man offside rule.

Seasonal breakdown at Dundee

21-22 Lge 28A 23G SC 3A 2G
22-23 Lge 26A 10G SC 8A 5G
23-24 Lge 36A 38G SC 3A 1G
24-25 Lge 36A 19G SC7A 5G

He has the best strike rate (goals to games ratio) of any Sunderland striker in that club’s history. 165 goals in 175 games (156 league from 166 games and nine in nine FA Cup outings) for an average of 0.943 goals per game. And remember, Sunderland include Brian Clough and Charlie Buchan among their past heroes. Only Buchan and all-time Sunderland top scorer Bobby Gurney have scored more goals for the club than Halliday. He scored more hat-tricks (12) than any other Sunderland player and hit four on three occasions.

Seasonal breakdown at Sunderland

25-26 Lge 42A 38G FAC 4A 4G
26-27 Lge 33A 36G FAC 1A 1G
27-28 Lge 38A 35G FAC 3A 4G
28-29 Lge 42A 43G FAC 1A 0G
29-30 Lge 11A 4G
29-30 with Arsenal Lge 15A 8G FAC 0A 0G

At Man City he scored a hat-trick against former club Sunderland in just ten minutes in January 1932. Seasonal breakdown for Man City

30-31 Lge 24 G 14 FAC1 G0
31-32 Lge 40A 28G FAC 5A 4G
32-33 Lge 8A 3G FAC 0A 0G
33-34 Lge 4A 2G FAC 0A 0G

Clapton Orient seasonal breakdown
33-34 21A 19G FAC 1A 0G
34-35 32A 14G FAC 2A 3G
He also scored a further three goals in the FA Cup proper for Yeovil & Petters United before taking over as Aberdeen manager in 1938.

You will see that some of my figures for Halliday’s goals differ from those in the Wikipedia article. There will always be discrepancies in goal tallies, particularly for pre-WW2 players. I take my figures from club histories wherever possible as I consider these to be more reliable than general stats. In this instance club histories for Dundee, Sunderland & Arsenal have been used in compiling the seasonal totals.

By my reckoning (and ignoring QoS figures which are non-league) he scored 92 league goals in Scotland in 145 appearances and a further 13 in 21 Scottish Cup appearances. In England he scored 244 league goals in 310 appearances and a further 19 FA Cup goals in an unknown number of appearances (18 while with league clubs) for a total of 368 first class goals. It’s worth noting that a large chunk of his career was spent playing under the old offside rule, that he was 23 or thereabouts before he played league football and that all his league goals bar those two seasons with Clapton Orient in the Third South were scored in the top flight in both Scotland and England.

Finally, Wikipedia notes he was never capped by Scotland but he did receive representative honours when he played for the Scottish League against the Football League in a 1-1 draw at Ibrox in March 1924.

Wikipedia also claims he played no matches in 1930-31. However since 1888 has him as playing for Man City that season and is a more reliable source.


Hi Scottish,

Thanks for all this great info. Can I ask please about Halliday's exploits at Yeovil?

a) This comment:

"He also scored a further three goals in the FA Cup proper for Yeovil & Petters United"

Seems to contradict this comment to my uneducated mind

"19 FA Cup goals in an unknown number of appearances (18 while with league clubs)"


Is it possible you could clarify that please?


b) Are details available of the game(s) in which Halliday scored for Yeovil in the FA Cup proper?


c) Did Halliday play for Yeovil in all his time there or just for the first two seasons?

Cheers for any help.
Dumpling
 
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Re: Dave Halliday

Postby Dumpling » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:34 am

Hi again Scottish,

I've been looking at the stats you posted trying to get my head around them. I am wondering if the remark, "(18 while with league clubs)" is a simple typo that should say 16 rather than 18?

In trying to fathom this out please accept my apologies in that I have a further question to add to those above. Is this also a typo?

-> 92 league goals in Scotland in 145 appearances

I wonder if 145 should say 139 (126 at Dundee + 13 at St Mirren)?

Cheers again for any help.
Dumpling
 
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