Official attendance query

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EastJunior
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Official attendance query

Post by EastJunior » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:20 pm

I'm looking for the official attendances for the following away Scotland games;

11/11/2011 v Cyprus in Larnaca
26/05/2012 v USA in Jacksonville
14/11/2012 v Luxembourg in Luxembourg City
29/05/2016 v Italy in Malta

Thanks.

bluedragon
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by bluedragon » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:03 am

The Scotland page on the RSSSF website maintained by Gabe gives the following attnedances:
11/11/2011 v Cyprus in Larnaca 1,360
26/05/2012 v USA in Jacksonville 44,438
14/11/2012 v Luxembourg in Luxembourg City 2,521
29/05/2016 v Italy in Malta 8,000

EastJunior
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by EastJunior » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:12 pm

bluedragon wrote:The Scotland page on the RSSSF website maintained by Gabe gives the following attnedances:
11/11/2011 v Cyprus in Larnaca 1,360
26/05/2012 v USA in Jacksonville 44,438
14/11/2012 v Luxembourg in Luxembourg City 2,521
29/05/2016 v Italy in Malta 8,000
Many thanks, do you have a link to that page? It'll help in cross checking some others that I'm not too confident are accurate.

bluedragon
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by bluedragon » Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:47 pm

Here is the link:

http://www.rsssf.com/tabless/scot-intres.html

Gabriele (“Gabe”) Tossani, who maintains the Scotland international record on the RSSSF website, posts on here from time to time usually to corroborate attendances, full names of players & stadia and goal times. It is a great resource.

EastJunior
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by EastJunior » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:17 pm

bluedragon wrote:Here is the link:

http://www.rsssf.com/tabless/scot-intres.html

Gabriele (“Gabe”) Tossani, who maintains the Scotland international record on the RSSSF website, posts on here from time to time usually to corroborate attendances, full names of players & stadia and goal times. It is a great resource.
A great resource, thanks.

EastJunior
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by EastJunior » Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:08 pm

Another question. When was the last time Scotland played in front of a home crowd of less than 20,000 for a WC or EC Qualifier? Late 90's during Hampden rebuild?

Swampy
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by Swampy » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:41 pm

EastJunior wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:08 pm
Another question. When was the last time Scotland played in front of a home crowd of less than 20,000 for a WC or EC Qualifier? Late 90's during Hampden rebuild?
Yes, Pittodrie on October 14th 1988, a 2-1 (!) win over the Faroes. 18,517. The same week at Tynecastle, on the 10th, 16,930 watched a thrilling 3-2 win over Estonia. These were both Euro 2000 qualifiers (so we all know how that went.)

Interestingly, only 20,435 watched the 1-0 win over Slovenia in the WCQ of 26 March 2017, probably because the die was cast by the home draw with Lithuania and the 3-0 defeat in Trnava earlier in the campaign.

But now, fast forward to 2019 from your post, and we finally have a sub-20,000 game at Hampden again. Just 19,515 watched the 3-1 demolition of Kazakhstan last month. (And if you take the Nations League into account, our lowest there was 17,455 watching the 2-0 win over Albania.)

LEATHERSTOCKING
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by LEATHERSTOCKING » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:07 pm

Incidentally, the RSSSF website is wrong regarding the venue of the first "official" international on St.Andrew`s Day 1872. The game was played on the ground of the West of Scotland Cricket and Football Club, Partick and Partick was NOT part of Glasgow at that time. It was an independent police burgh until 1912. The football section moved out to Milngavie(pronounced "Mullguy") in 1945. As a junior architect, my first design job was their first club house/changing rooms 20 years later.

In addition to the 1872 game being a continuation of the "unofficial" England/Scotland games of 1870 to February 1872, was also more an agreed "replay" of the Wanderers vs. Queen`s Park English Cup semi final of March 1872 where Queen`s had scratched after a 0-0 draw due to lack of funds for a return to London for an official replay. - all games @ this stage of the competition to be played in London.

Gabe
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by Gabe » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:30 pm

First of all sorry for my not good English.

Thank you Leatherstocking to point out the problem of Partick/Glasgow.
You are right.
I will update the page of the RSSSF website as soon as possible.

I wonder if they are necessary other amendments for similar cases, i.e. Govan/Glasgow as for the matches at Ibrox (end of '800s and first of '900) and the same years for Aston/Birmingham for the matches at Villa Park.

I wait your point of view.

Thanks a lot

ScottishFA
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by ScottishFA » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:50 am

This just opens a big can of worms, eg Wembley was not formally in London until 1965. There are probably others.

prorege
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by prorege » Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:15 am

Perhaps it never hosted a Full International, but it certainly hosted many minor ones - what about Shawfield?

One corner flag in Glasgow, the rest of the ground in Rutherglen.

See attached map.
Attachments
Map Shawfield.jpg
Map Shawfield.jpg (230.14 KiB) Viewed 1260 times

bluedragon
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by bluedragon » Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:03 am

A great map!

From what I read Rutherglen became part of Glasgow in 1975. Junior Scotland played four matches there and a Scotland XI played the British Army in 1955. As you say, it would have been a regular venue for other representative matches and many Junior cup finals.

The international against Wales at Easter Road in 1888 would have been played in the old ground (Hibernian Park) that is where Bothwell Street is today. I reckon that would have been in Edinburgh at the time. Today’s Easter Road Stadium would have been within the Leith boundary prior to 1920.

LEATHERSTOCKING
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by LEATHERSTOCKING » Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:57 pm

The first time a Scottish International match was actually played within the boundaries of the City of Glasgow was vs. England @ Hampden Park in 1906. All matches prior to that had been in adjoining burghs eg. Govan, Crosshill, Parkhead, Partick which housed Ibrox Park, Cathkin Park(both), Hampden Parks(all 3), Celtic Park(both) & West of Scotland Cricket & Football Club. Old programmes which I have(1960s) have EMPIRE STADIUM, WEMBLEY on the front cover; when did it become WEMBLEY STADIUM?

bluedragon
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by bluedragon » Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:24 pm

LEATHERSTOCKING wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:57 pm
Old programmes which I have(1960s) have EMPIRE STADIUM, WEMBLEY on the front cover; when did it become WEMBLEY STADIUM?
I believe the name change was associated with the 50th anniversary of the stadium in 1973 although "Wembley Stadium" was not consistently used on all programmes until the 1974/75 season.

bluedragon
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Re: Official attendance query

Post by bluedragon » Sat Sep 12, 2020 11:24 am

bluedragon wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:24 pm
LEATHERSTOCKING wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:57 pm
Old programmes which I have(1960s) have EMPIRE STADIUM, WEMBLEY on the front cover; when did it become WEMBLEY STADIUM?
I believe the name change was associated with the 50th anniversary of the stadium in 1973 although "Wembley Stadium" was not consistently used on all programmes until the 1974/75 season.
A little more…

It looks as if the Empire Stadium may have been an early example of naming rights! The company that built and then ran the stadium was Wembley Stadium and Greyhound Racecourse Limited and it changed its name in 1930 to Wembley Stadium Limited. During its construction as part of the British Empire Exhibition (1924) grounds at Wembley it was called “Wembley Stadium” although later “Empire Stadium” came into common usage.

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